Regarding clock works and clock hands

Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 3:36 am     Post subject: Regarding clock works and clock hands

Hi all,

If I buy a clock movement set from Klockit.com (http://www.klockit.com/products/dept-157__sku-10079.html) but buy the clock hands from elsewhere, are the two parts guaranteed to fit nicely?

Or do I need to take measurements and make sure the two parts will fit in nicely with each other?

I was thinking maybe there's some sort of international clock-making guideline / standards which says how wide the holes of the clock hand must be, and how wide the shaft of the clock works must be, so they all fit in nicely regardless of where we buy it.

Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 12:56 pm     Post subject:

There are cases where different hands will not fit different movements (even if they are the same style of movement). Sadly - there is no industry standard when it comes to hand shaft size.

Typically - if you are purchasing a Quartz (battery-operated) movement, Klockit includes the hands of your choice free with the movement (unless otherwise noted). There are a couple of movements (high torque for example) that are excluded from this constant-running hand promotion.

So, if you were going to order a standard movement, you might as well select the free hands that come with it. But note: The movement from your posted link will require "push-on" hands - not the I-shaft style hand.

As a side note - if you do not like the hand selection offered for the push-on movements, try switching to a standard (I-shaft) quartz movement like #10002 (also available in various length hand shafts). The standard quartz offers more of a selection in different hand styles.

Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 2:02 am     Post subject:

Thanks for the reply, Chris.....btw, you don't happen to know of any company or individuals who do custom clock hands, right?

Nice day!
Xeon

Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 12:54 pm     Post subject:

In regard to hands: Not off hand - no pun intended -

To the best of my awareness, most hands (these days) are manufactured in China. Custom hands may be an option, but the minimum purchase requirement would probably be the prohibitive factor. Still, you never know what you may find with a little exploration... and it never hurts to look.

Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:22 pm     Post subject:

Hi Chris!

Yeah, I browsed through some Chinese sites and some of them, their minimum orders are anywhere from 500 - 5000.

Anyway, I found this British site which makes custom clock hands:
http://www.clockmovements.co.uk

It might be more expensive, but I'll be contacting them soon.
Then, maybe I could send them a Klockit clock movement and get them to make hands to fit the clock movement nicely.

Btw, do you know what's the meaning of "bushing"?
I see on klockit that some clock movement says "Standard Push-On Movement with Bushing".

See ye'!
Xeon

Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 9:29 pm     Post subject:

In the realm of quartz clock movements - the bushing is an alternative to the hex nut. For lack of better description, a bushing is usually a "collar" of sorts with a threaded portion at the end. This threaded portion will screw directly to the face of the movement (sandwiching the dial and dial board in between). The only real drawback to bushings is that they have no play in the manner of your maximum dial thickness. With the hex nut, I have the liberty of spacing the movement back if the need should be (especially with a longer shaft movement). Depending on the bushing collar length (also indicated as maximum dial thickness), your dial/dial board thickness must accommodate the bushing collar length. So if the movement uses a bushing, and maximum dial thickness is listed as 3/8", then the total thickness of your dial and dial board would have to be 3/8" (no less, no more). Hope I was able to describe this in a manner that is easy to understand…

Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 1:57 am     Post subject:

Thanks Chris! Yeah, I must admit it's kinda overwhelming, the description.

So, in short, if I'm a total beginner and I'm not sure about all these measurements etc., I should go with those clock movements with "no bushing"?

I only know about George Bush, btw.

Thanks,
Xeon

Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 1:00 pm     Post subject:

I do recommend the hex nut option, unless the movement features you want are only available with that which comes with the bushing. I know that a specific style of chiming quartz movements only come with the bushing option (#12082 & #12190 series, for example).

Ultimately, you should select the movement which has the options you desire. No matter which movement you choose, you are welcome to contact us for questions in regard to mounting. We would be happy to help in any way we can.

As a side note: A retired local town doctor (here in Lake Geneva) actually used to bunk with George W back in their college days. Bet he would have some stories neither of us would know about...

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 3:12 am     Post subject:

Thanks Chris! Btw, do you happen to know of anywhere which sells custom clock inserts? I'm considering the possibility of replacing the clock face with my own designed clock face.

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 1:06 pm     Post subject:

As a matter of fact, what could be better than a manufacturer of custom clocks? How about the ability to manufacture your own custom clock inserts…

Klockit offers a product for teachers that may fit the application you are interested in. The Clock Insert Module Lesson Pack (#49648) will feature a template CD (used in conjunction with a free program download from Avery) to make your own custom dial faces for a 3-7/8" clock insert. It also comes with a sample 3-7/8" insert that you assemble (complete with your own custom clock face). The lesson pack will include insert assembly instructions, as well as clock face printing instructions (simply disregard the class lesson plan which is also included as part of the instruction materials).

You only need to buy the lesson pack once, as we sell separate clock insert module kits (#156837) which contain just the insert parts for making additional custom clock inserts. The template CD-ROM included with the lesson pack can be used again and again.

The best part is that since you will be your own manufacturer (of sorts), you have no sort of minimum quantity purchase or outrageous pricing for custom inserts. Cut out the middle man (so to speak). About $10 for the lesson pack (not including shipping and handling charges) will get you started. Additional 3-7/8” clock insert module kits are about $8. The only other thing you need is a computer with a decent printer (which is not hard to find in most households these days).

We also offer a custom dial template CD-ROM for 8-1/2" plastic wall clocks in a customizable wall clock lesson plan (#49649). Feel free to search all the stock numbers listed above on the Klockit website for more information. Also – feel free to reply with any further questions…

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 2:55 pm     Post subject:

Hi Chris! Thanks, you've been really helpful!
I'll check those things out.....they look very interesting and pretty promising.

Btw, I see that you also have the following type of clock inserts:

http://www.klockit.com/products/dept-31__sku-MMMMM.html
http://www.klockit.com/products/dept-31__sku-15644.html

Do these come with clock hands and all the necessary parts too?

Good day!
Xeon

Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 1:18 pm     Post subject:

Actually - those are simply photo inserts (and do not come with hands). They are only used for displaying a photo. They can, however, be used on a project with multiple inserts. But, if you want to use your own photo as the clock face, I would not recommend these inserts (and stick with the insert module and plan listed previously).

Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:02 am     Post subject:

Hi Chris,

Thanks for your e-mail. After some planning for the past few days, I've decided to stick with my original plan of ordering a dozen quartz clock movements first.

For this clock movement ( http://www.klockit.com/products/dept-157__sku-Premium_Quartex_Brand_Push_On_Movement.html ) / #10059, I've some questions:

1) The specs say the movement size is 2 7/32" square x 5/8"D, so I assume it can be translated to 2.21" long and 0.6" thick?

2) If my clock dial is just a piece of paper and not some thick card etc, this movement can work too, right? (I'll be fixing the movement onto a piece of laminated paper)

3) My clock dial is 3" by 3", so will this #10059 work out fine? Or do I need to make my dial bigger?

Thanks for your patience!
Nikar

Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:07 pm     Post subject:

1.) Technically speaking, the size would translate to 2.21875" square X .625" thick. If your prefer to shy away from 1/32” dimensions and decimal equivalents, then think of the movement as almost 2-1/4” square (just a hair under).

2.) I am not quite certain how this movement secures (whether with a threaded bushing or via double stick tape). That being said, I can only be general (at best) in regard to dial mounting suggestions. For most dial mounting applications (especially with paper faces), I prefer to use some type of composite wood (like MDF, plywood veneer, plywood, etc). This gives me a solid surface to mount the paper face to. Your composite material can be the exact same diameter as the clock face (if you prefer). #10059 has a maximum dial thickness of 5/16". You could make a 1/4" thick plywood back board and mount your paper dial to the front surface (1/4" plywood veneer should be available at local lumber yards, etc). The combined thickness of the plywood and paper (even if the paper is laminated) should still be under the 5/16" requirement for the #10059.

3.) When measured diagonally, the movement is about 3". The clock face you have selected will probably just about cover the movement in the corners (although it will be tight). If you have the means to enlarge the face, I would consider doing so (to about 3-1/4" up to 3-1/2”) – just to be certain the corners of the movement would not be exposed.

Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:36 pm     Post subject:

Thanks a lot for the answers, Chris!

I'm also thinking of buying several #15681, and then opening up the insert and taking out the clock dial, and replacing it with my own.

Maybe Klockit should one day consider offering custom square clock insert module kits.
Like #15683, but square / rectangular instead of circular.

Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:45 pm     Post subject:

We can certainly look into square (customizable) inserts. I would be happy to pass it along as a suggestion.

As a side note: I have not really had a chance to look over the current square inserts to see if they would lend themselves to disassembly. Make certain to check the insert over carefully before attempting to disassemble it. Also remember that any modifications may void Klockit's warranty... so you may want to use a single one as a "test subject" initially (to make certain it will re-assemble, maintain proper time, etc).

A little bit of experimentation goes a long way...

Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 3:28 pm     Post subject:

Thanks Chris!

One more thing (sorry for being a total nuisance).
Regarding this clock movement #10059, pls see my commented picture below:



I'm ordering some custom wooden clock dials from a supplier now and need to tell them how big to drill the hole.

Thanks!
Xeon

Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 4:36 pm     Post subject:

The largest "collar" of the movement center shaft measures .229". Where .25 is exactly 1/4", the diameter will equate to a "hair" over 7/32" in diameter (where "hair", in this case, is defined as about half of 1/64").

It is important to note that wood is typically prone to shrinkage and expansion. While it is entirely up to you, I would actually recommend a center hole through the dial measuring 9/32" in diameter (5/16" max). 1/4" hole would be the absolute minimum (although this would leave little room for spacing around the shaft)

Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2008 2:54 am     Post subject:

Hi Chris,

I'm about to order my custom-made dial soon from a manufacturer, and will be buying the clock movements soon.

Some questions again:

1) For the Clear Quartz movements here, http://www.klockit.com/products/dept-157__sku-AAAVV.html , I notice that the Maximum Dial Thickness for the black cases can go up to 3/4", but the clear cases can only go up to 1/2" at most. Or do you have a clear case movement which offers 3/4" dial thickness?

2) Is there any tools to fix the hour and minute hands nicely onto the movement? I bought a sample movement from my clock shop recently just to get a feel of how clock movements are like, and I had a hard time screwing the hour and minute hand onto the movement, and ended up slightly bending the hands. I used my own human hands, btw.

3) For this image here: http://www.klockit.com/zoom_img/AAAVV.jpg
The Hour and Minute hands look very good, so I wonder if they are sold separately elsewhere on your website? The closest I can find is: 66807 and 67921 (http://www.klockit.com/products/dept-5__sku-white_hands.html), but those are white hands, not black or gold.

4) For 10059, on the website, it says: "Use adhesive to secure your dial to this movement". So, that means I'm supposed to use either tape and glue?

5) For 10153, I assume it's compatible with 66807, 67921 and 68105?

Thanks!
Nikar